Jan 4, 2004

Blender Sucks

by Some Yahoo at 6:25 PM

I like to play with 3D modeling. It takes a lot of my time, and the results are meager at best for an amateur like me. I can spend 30 hours designing a one-eighth of a space cruiser, only to give up because it takes 4 hours to render an image. Ok, well I find it fun.

I have tried a lot of different programs to do this stuff with – there is some really good stuff out there. I like the simplicity and understandability of POV-Ray, I like the easy animation utilities in Caligari TrueSpace. To do this kind of thing professionally, you need a good program like 3DS Max. I understand that although costly, it’s the industry standard in 3D.

But since this is but a hobby to me, I needed something more along the lines of freeware. So my good friend told me about Blender. “It’s complicated, but it will let you get started”.

The Failure of Open Source

Well, it didn’t let me get started. First, there was no manual. There’s no support department. I did a web search for “Blender tutorial”, and the results I got that weren’t about making margaritas, were by individual users who just documented some thing they had managed to accomplish with Blender. The problem is that it isn’t professional grade – not one bit of it.

The first tutorial told me to load a sample file that came on the CD I never bought because I downloaded the software. I did a web search for the blender sample project files and got nothing.

The next tutorial looked great! Make a mountain in 15 minutes. Except that it assumed that I am already an experienced Blender user. It said things like:

select the top vertecies with the border select (B Key) and Move them down (G Key).

Ok, apart from the bad spelling, punctuation, and capitalization, I was unable in an hour to select the top vertices doing ANY COMBINATION of things with the B key. It just didn’t work as easily as the tutorial explained. I figured that I would just skip that part, and move on. Then I got to this:

Use Border Select to select 3 sets of vertices on both sides of the surface and Subdivide.

Again, there was no way I could select any vertices at all. Whatever I tried the whole mesh remained selected and there was no way to do anything other than translate (move) the whole thing around the screen. So I gave up but read on till I got to the following line – keep in mind that this tutorial was supposed to be mountains in 15 minutes:

By the way, you need to have some sort of texture assigned to the mesh for the 'Noise' to be visible.

I like that. “some sort of texture”. Hmmm. So this tutorial is easy and quick only after hours of preparing textures, and figuring out what to do with the (B) key.

So I scanned the tutorial for some email address I could use to get some clarification from it’s author. Guess what – THERE WAS NONE. I tried the Blender site for a manual, and here’s what I found…

The manual designers are suffering from big delays... already working since half november they can't get it ready in time. Originally the book should be in print now, but the expectation is this will start after 2nd week of january earliest.

What a shock! No manual! And I bet it’s no better than the tutorials I saw. The upshot is that if you want to use open source software, you have to settle for no support, no quality, no manual, no recourse if you can’t get your job done.

Suddenly the thousands that it costs to go with 3DS Max seems worth it. I can e-mail support and ask why I can’t select a vertex, or how I can make mountains, it’s all part of having a real, commercial quality piece of software. You get manuals, and there are thousands of 3rd party plug-ins for it.

The storel of this morey is that you get what you pay for – you always have and you always will.

this is... 

59 comments:

  1. yep, blender is crap.
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  2. Blender is pretty good for free I guess, but compared to any of the other programs you mentioned it is pretty bad.
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  3. KI've been using blender for almost 6 months now, and although it is very hard to learn it, you can still create images like any other 3D package. Have a look at the gallery at www.blenderartists.org/forum. There you will also find a huge amount of tutorials in the tutorial section. You posted this in 2004. The latest release of blender 2.44.1 is an excellent release and they are planning another release later this year. With they way they release it now, and how other 3rd party programs and renderers gets build to support blender, I cant see how this wont even become the best 3d package. Its free, supported (on the forums you can ask for assistance - although it never failed me, nor never crashed, cutting edge 3d application. The manual is an open source manual which gets constantly updated. see wiki.blender.org
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  4. Like djarielm said, they have good tutorials now. And I thought I saw a manual, maybe they just released that too. But here's a hint. To select anything ou have to hit TAB. Hitting tab will take it from just selecting objects to being able to edit them. Hit it once to go into edit mode, and then hit it again to go back to object mode. Go to object mode to select whole objects and edit mode to select verticies, edges, etc. And as for subdivide, just poke around through the program until you find a button labeled "subdivide." And isn't there some kind of help file included on the program? Mine has a help file you can access from within the program.

    I hope this helps and good luck with all the 3D stuff you do. (But if you really wany a good modeler, look at LightWave 9.2. They have a free 30 day all-features included trial for their software. They also have lots of tutorial videos.)
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  5. Blender has a lot of advanced features. When you know how to use it, it models real easily, and renders like a dream. I'd say the way it renders is even comparable to expensive programs like 3d studio max . I have never even had it crash. That doesn't seem like crap to me. And considering that its free, it's a godsend.

    Of course you make a point - there aren't any good manuals out there for it. But I say: so what. Blender isn't for people who read manuals. It isn't for those content to just look up instructions without having an intuitive understanding of why the commands in question work. Blender won't coddle you. Blender is tough love.

    If you want to learn Blender, just dive right in. Try clicking buttons and figure out what they do. Know the program inside and out. The online manual isn't there to teach you - its just there for reference.

    BTW The support for it is getting better and there are a few good tutorials now. All the reference stuff is wiki now, so if you find a problem with the manuals or the tutorials, just go ahead and fix it yourself.
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  6. I'm thinking of starting a page/blog called "Blender Sucks."

    The interface is just atrocious.

    The first time I used Truespace, it just clicked with me. Lightwave? Brilliantly intuitive. Even more so than 3DS, Maya, etc. How can it be that hard to develop a straightforward, no nonsese interface? Blender uses convoluted methods to accomplish simple tasks.

    Like a chump, every 6 months I'll download it again, my rationale being, "It's free and maybe it's improved."

    It is the worst, most counter productive graphics app out there, bar none.

    You get what you pay for -- nothing.
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  7. blender is one of the best, as far as free programs go. You said the tut was hard? DON'T START WITH THE ADVANCED TUTORIALS! They assume you already have the basics. There's a good tutorial right here for beginners. http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Blender_3D:_Noob_to_Pro
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  8. The "b" key works in edit mode only. hit tab to go in it. Then hit b, click and drag and a box should appear. anything inside that box will be selected.
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  9. fullflavormentholFeb 4, 2008 09:19 PM
    While it isn't impossible to learn Blender, it does suffer from the worst layout of any program I have ever seen. Which is really sad, because this free program contains a fluid simulation that beats 3ds/Maya/C4D hands down.

    It is actually good, but yet a testament to what is wrong with the open source movement. With a smaller group you get improvements, but after the software gets too many people behind everyone gets too defensive about how great it is; and hence the program never really improves.

    You see the proprietary boys have to improve their software interface or lose customers, but after a few years Blender folk just started labeling anyone who brought up suggestions for improvements as noobs.

    This is bad, because I can use Maya/3ds/C4D. I sure as hell am not ignorant about CADD/CG applications, and I can use Blender; but I know it would be more widely adopted if the detractors were actually listened too instead of shouted down all the time.
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  10. I hate blender. It is Powerful, oh yes. But if you can't access that power it is meaningless.

    And that is the problem with Blender. It has the most infuriating interface. Especially if you (Heaven forbid) learned 3d animation on Maya or 3d Max!
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  11. The deal with Blender is it was made before there was any such thing as a "standard gui interface". What you think of as "standard" is just MS Windows standard.

    They were having to create a 3d modelling interface with nothing to reference.
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  12. FullflavormentholMar 6, 2008 09:00 PM
    Blender was made after 1998, which means there had already been an industry standard for years. BTW there was a gui standard before MS; which is what almost all programs resemble.

    Blender suffers from a lot of hidden menus. Simply drag at the very top of the display and you will find a menu that no one would think to look for up there.

    I don't hate the program, but damn! Redesign the damn thing and get taken seriously in the CG world.
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  13. Blender did a great job on GAUE (graphic anti-user experience). People say is great, I disagree, bad user interface and hard to learn. I'm pretty good at many programs (professionally) I'm no beginner... But blender... doesn't let me play
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  14. Blender has the ugliest, most convoluted, most illogical interface of any software that I used in the last 30 years. How anyone can defend such an atrocious interface in the 21st century is beyond me. Problem with open source is closed minds. All the developers have to do is look around at other software who have decent, usable interfaces. Commercial software developers know a thing or two about interfaces, and have spent a great deal of time and money to research things. It's a shame most OS developers are unwilling to admit that commercial developers too can have good ideas.
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  15. FullflavormentholJul 27, 2008 08:35 PM
    "It's a shame most OS developers are unwilling to admit that commercial developers too can have good ideas."

    Because they, and the communities, get caught up in defending their system so much that they ignore critism; no matter how legitimate it is.

    I remember bringing up this very point to someone in the Blender community once, and their response was,

    "Once you spend a few months with it you'll learn how inane your criticism really is."

    That is the perfect testiment to the hubris of the Open Source community. You have programmers with big egos that are unwilling to look at what the end user needs, and proponents that are so convinced that they will be the end of the proprietary world that they classify all criticism as "FUD".

    The sad fact is that many simply ignore 3DS, Maya, and C4D because they have convinced themselves that their pet program is the greatest thing in the world. Many who I have encountered will actually brag that their program was used for things it obviously wasn't. While the entire code needs to be re-written from the ground up to make it actually comparible to the standards. Blender would have been great...in the mid 90's. Now it is showing its age while getting left in the dust by Autodesk.
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  16. >There’s no support department

    lolamericans
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  17. I can't afford to buy a professional 3d package at the time, so I decided to learn Blender. The documentation is not bad: it's almost non-existent. Some topics are related to past versions of the software.

    And the interface is terrible, I mean really terrible. It's absolutely non-intuitive, and the so-called "community" doesn't want even talk about changes. The argument: "Blender interface is good for experienced users"...

    My overall opinion about Blender: it's a strong core, packed with an absolutely lack of professionalism, typical of OpenSource software. It's directed to hobbysts, people who want to show something to "those guys of Autodesk"...

    Some new interface is being promised to version 2.50. Let's wait and see.
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  18. Now, I must disagree on you when you say Blender sucks, for I really like it. And when it comes to tutorials: they're supposed to help you understand the blender engine...The tutorial I used was this one: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Blender_3D:_Noob_to_Pro

    It would really help out if you did this entire one (like 100 hours of work), because when you're done, you know most about Blender or at least the basics...
    (only issue is that it's made based on version 2.42 and some tuts won't work out on higher versions, but that's just a small part of em)
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  19. I hate this Blender garbage, as someone who started out trying his hand at 3d Blender was the worst package I ever tapped into. Its just too confusing even as a professional grade software that they claim, I started playing with something called AC3D and Wings 3D. I liked those packages a hell lot more than Blender and I actually walked away with some understanding, later on I applied what I learned in Maya and was surprised with ease of use in its features. However its quickly became tiresome, Maya is a great animation package but unfortunately that's all it is. Playing with nurbs is hell, eventually you get the hang of it but not before you trip over live mines. Finally I found the stuff that changed my life and thats 3D Studio, does exactly what I need and thinks like I do. Bottom line being, what ever works for you as an artist stick to it but stay the hell away from Blender and I told you so.

    :)
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  20. I am Mexican, so my native languaje is spanish, still, I have found great and easy to understand blander manuals at blender's official webpage, I have been trying it 4 a while and I think its awesome.
    I think some complaint about it because they're way to lazy to sit and read 4 a while b 4 the try 2 use it, No pain, no gain.
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  21. Blender needs a new (possibly an alternative) GUI. The current one was written by geeks that know everything about hardcore graphics and paid no attention to the user experience. Something all too common (and not just in open source). If this had been a commercial venture it would have failed miserably.

    If the app is properly written (Model, Views, Controllers) then rewritting the GUI should be possible without changing the backend.

    As it stands it sucks.
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  22. Apperiantly you did very little searching for tutorials and manuals.
    True, MOST of the tutorials you find are created by users. But that's the same case with ALL software. It's the users that master the programs, and learned to script for it. Photoshop is a great example. You don't honestly think Adobe came up with all those features on their own do you?
    There is also a great manual released with each major upgrade of Blender (2.0, 2.5, 3.0, etc). You just need something, then head to the manufacture's main site. Duh.
    Don't get upset because a home-made tutorial didn't work for you. Ask the creator what version of the software it was created for. Your version may be older or newer then their's. It makes a HUGE differance with any program.
    There is NOTHING wrong with Open Source software. I relaise this blog was created in 2004. And Blender wasn't as versitile as it is now. But at that time, Blender was still very usable as it is today. The only real differance is that the NOW features were User Created PlugIns back then.

    Hope you've given the program another chance. Do you honestly think your friend would have suggested it if it "Sucks?"
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  23. I hate blender, worst software ever created. If you want to go open source there are better programs more deserving of applause my favorite in open source is "Wings 3d" there is just so much possibility with its simple design. As a personal and professional choice I stick to 3ds Max it thinks the way I do, the results are well worth what I create in it.
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  24. Socialist application.

    Why socialist? Socialism depends on the decisions and visions of many, and not the vision of one. This results in chaos.

    Blender programmers are brilliant, but lacks one vision in regards to its user interface which is I refer to as a "half-ass job".

    Ergo the old saying: "too many cooks spoil the broth".
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  25. I've dabbled with blender off and on for about 8 years now. I agree with a lot of the people here about it having the absolute worst GUI in existence. Nevertheless, it appears that nightmare is coming to an end if they ever release version 2.5...it really does look promising and I'm tempted to give it another whirl once it's released.
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  26. Blender is powerful enough to do some fun, decent things with, easily passable commercially if you're clever about it and know how to use it, but therein lies the problem. This is how I use Blender...

    Step 1.) I have a goal and 90% of the knowledge I need to do it in Blender.

    Step 2.) I hit that 10% I don't know how to do.

    Step 3.) I spend fourteen days trying to find a conversation or file about how to do that 10% through the Blender online community to no avail.

    Step 4.) I figure it out on my own.

    Once you forego your dependence on Step 3 and become a Step 4 kind of person, Blender if very powerful. It's sort of like the puzzlebox from Hellraiser that way.

    Step 3 usually goes like this...

    I go to Blender help forums and do a search. I find someone who has my same problem. The response this person gets is condescending insults about how they should have done a search for the answer before asking and then they fail to provide an answer or a link that works. So I can either search again, which turns up no results, or sign up to the forum and ask, which apparently was a worthless tactic for the person who came before me.

    I think because of the volatility and territorialism of the Blender forum community, obvious features aren't put into upgrades because the people who would suggest them are met with anger and defensiveness.

    Fortunately, the thing that carries this out of the domain of a rant and into useful information is the YouTube Blender Community, which is full of so much good, wonderful, information by intelligent, no-nonsense people that it renders the forum communities immediately obsolete.

    If you want to know how to do something in Blender and Step 4 isn't working, start Step 3 with YouTube, I usually find what I need there. Go to the online forums only when the only other option is getting a different program and NEVER underestimate Step 4. The more you know, the easier it is to figure something out.
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  27. Stop blaming blender for god sake...you must be really dumb...no offence but it's true...i saw that some of the users that posted above are "professionals", or so they say. Well i am a noob you hear me? a noob, that started 5 months ago learning blender. a noob that never attended computer classes or so, a noob that did not had anything to do with computers other than playing games and chating. and yes, 5 months ago, with my huge stupidness, i started learning blender by myself, with only my computer, blender software and lots and lots of internet tutorials...and i can say now that i know and love blender (for sure i will discover many more), but i started working with a friend on makeing applications and games for apple, and working hard to get an online browser 3d game up and running. so you "professional" guys, do not tell me that blender is crap....it's just that you do not have the patience to learn it....and i understand perfectly because i myself do not think that i would have the patience to learn 3dsmax now...but you will never hear me saying that 3dsmax is crap just because i do not know how to work with it....SO in conclusion, if a guy like me, noob to 3d animation and graphics, and EVEN computers, could learn blender, than you "professional" guys should stop saying that blender is crap, and admit that it's your problem for not giveing time and patience to learn it.
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  28. are you kidding me guys? Blender is a complete pile of crap. Look at how offensive the blender defenders get even here. You go to the community and you get treated like total crap. You have one little bad thing to say about it or ask one single noob question you will get your head bitten off. They will yell at you telling you that you should do research and look before posting, What if I did? WHat if my dumba** couldn't find it. I came to them for help, not to get yelled at and called dumb. Every one and there brother says blender GUI sucks balls. EVERYONE, except the blender loyal of course. And the community will sit a swear EVERYONE is wrong and its our fault for not taking a thousand hours to completely relearn an app. I use other 3d packages and have memory reactions. Its a big deal to have to completely relearn this while im trying to get paid for a project. If the GUI was the same I could jump right in. Not changing the GUI is just another way blender is saying F-YOU, everyone is wrong, and if you dont like it, your the assh**e for not being more patient. I will NEVER use blender again because of the way i was treated in the forum. I was talked to awful. And even if the community wasn't bastards i still wouldn't use it because the GUI is so bad, id have better luck using my toes in Modo.
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  29. I have used Max for a number of years... but I switched to Blender just because it is better designed for modeling than Max. I really like Blender's UI, because it is really intuitive... while M$ based standard GUI for 3DS Max is far far away from it. I could not imagine were you people get problems with Blender UI. It's designed for modeling, not for t-bar button pushing and stupid 3D helpers messing all screen around. You get a full screen for modeling with a single key click. You switch projections with a single click. while Max is loaded with all these crappy tool bar buttons.
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  30. This is the old Word vs. WordPerfect argument from the 1990s. Word had tons of toolbars, menus, and wizards, while in WordPerfect you were screwed if you didn't already know that Control-K-B-F7-J-J-Esc meant "bold". It's true that experienced Wordperfect users were extremely more productive than Word users, because, for touch typists, you never had to take your hands off the keyboard to touch the mouse. HOWEVER: the learning curve was steep and you had to remember horrendous command sequences (which were in no way mnemonic) to get the simplest things done.

    I am not arguing that Blender is not powerful - clearly it is. What I am complaining about is that the documentation sucks eggs and the UI is so non-intuitive as to be impossible. As a new user who just wanted to create a simple mesh to suck into POV-Ray (way back when I tried Blender) I started reading the scant docs, and found myself unable to create a single triangle after hours of anguish.

    So, it's powerful, yes: but intuitive, no, and well-documented, no. Thats why it sucks. And no, I am not going to download it for a fourth time hoping it has changed.

    By the way - since Microsoft bought Truespace, it has become one of the horrible dogs that crashes, is too hard to figure out, and refuses to do the simplest task (like subtract one solid shape from another at random and without explanation. Therefore, Truespace now sucks as well.
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  31. Slice your wrists then pour in some iodine. Now eat some broken glass while drawing your nails across the blackboard. Cut some Styrofoam with a dull knife and now your ready to learn Blender.

    Every time I get to the point where I think "ya this programs not bad" it throws something at me that make me want to kick my cat over the power lines. What Blender has taught me is that I'm fairly sure now that I am capable of manslaughter!

    Just point me in the direction of one of the developers please.
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  32. Coming from Cinema 4d, solid network rendering or the lack of in blender has really pissed me off. What I think alot of OSS advocates forget is that the reason why artists are willing to pay put for art software is because they're artists, not programmers. When I feel inspired to create something and instead have to research complicated ways in which I can get it rendered, the passion fades. I have 10 machines running Netrender (c4d) and all I have to do is upload a file to get the ball running. No scripts, no command line. No break in flow. I am new to OSS and what I am finding out is that it works best in theory. Reality says be done on Friday before 5pm.
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  33. FullflavormentholMay 27, 2009 11:34 PM
    Wow, I have never had any "helpers" pop up in either Maya or 3ds Max or C4D. Nevertheless I can move very easily between all those programs and back to photoshop with no problem. The GUI is solid and easy to understand for the non-user. THIS IS THE POINT OF A PROFESSIONAL APP. The average person doesn't have the time to learn every little point of the GUI before they even begin to model something. Okay? I installed Illustrator and was creating my first picture before even thinking about a tutorial. I took an advanced class in 3ds without knowing anything about the program and was able to pick it up.

    Oh and BTW...I USE BLENDER as well. I am pointing out problems with the GUI that make it hard for new users to even consider using it. BTW...I am most other people disregard automatically any post that refers to a standard GUI as a "M$ GUI", because it first shows that the person has little knowledge of computer history and that they are so into the open source cult that they refuse to see any criticism of potentially great O.S.S. as anything other than evil M$ or APPLE$$$$ trying to keep them down.

    Blender has a fine engine for free, a fine fluid simulator for free; but a horrible GUI that makes it impossible for many to learn it. And no it shouldn't take you more than a month to get the hang of the GUI. Sorry, but most people I have seen can begin modeling in 3ds or Maya in under a month.

    There are simple fixes for the GUI, but all I have ever gotten for proposing them is "well you just need to give it time" even though I have used the program for over 2 years. I just use it as part of a system that includes its competitors in a composite environment for the finished product. So yeah, while the 3ds and Max users are learning all their advanced features like fire, hair, physics, ect. Blender users are busy learning the GUI and how to download those addons that allow them to actually compete.

    Good day sir!
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  34. FullflavormentholMay 29, 2009 09:28 PM
    All I am bringing up is that the Blender Foundation should start asking people what needs to be changed. I, and several hundreds of professionals, could tell them what needs to be done.

    As far a tutorials, well that is another problem. Too often I read tutorials that begin with..."I am going to assume you know the basic functions.." WRONG! Wrong!. With a program like Blender, you need to write every tutorial as if the person reading it is a moron. Not because they are, but because the program is that hard. Not only that, but because it is OSS that chances are your tutorial might reach the top of a search and bury other more basic tutorials.

    So...sorry to say, but...your fluid simulation might have to begin with a basic tutorial on how to make shapes first. I know it sucks, but the hardcore users will hang on and the beginners will thank you. I try to follow this philosophy with writting my tutorials for Blender, and I think the rest of you should too.


    So...

    1.) The GUI needs to be simplified to help the beginner, even if that means creating an add-on to create a simple GUI. (Sorry, I am not a programmer and can't do it)

    2.) Our tutorials needs to be fully written and geared towards to basic user so that everyone can use this program.

    3.) Stop with the holier than thou crap. It doesn't effect me, but it sure as hell pushes the end user out of trying out the program.

    4.) Blender is good, but not so in its present form for the end user..WITHOUT HELP. So STFU when thinking about mocking the beginners. Push a better GUI, and write actual tutorials that make it a point to help the students of Blender!
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  35. BLENDER SUCKS!!!!!
    First and most important reason: Poor interface. The usability level is lame. Support? You can forget it of course.

    To make boxes and spheres and other primitives to grasp the concept of a CG 3D environment, yeah it's great.

    Wanna really get into 3d graphics? Go download yourself Maya PE or some other commercial software and have fun.

    It took me over 2 hours to familiarize myself with Blender's interface (and of course after 2 hours I was still clicking and dragging the wrong objects all the time) Instead Maya makes it all easy.

    I think Maya has the best interface ever (hotbox rules!) - it's actually a matter of taste. (and yeah in Maya you can build a mountain in 1 minute with displacement maps)

    Sorry folks but Blender is for amateurs (and hell I'm no pro)
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  36. Hi,

    for years I was unable to learn 3DSMax. You know: first trying to install successfully a huuuge app, next cracking it (welcome to the real world, my friend), and next following tutorials at least as counterintuitives and bad like the blender ones.

    The blender learnig curve is steep? perhaps it is. But for me, even admitting some improvements that we hope for the 2.5 release, it has the most intuitive interface which I've faced in the 3D world.

    There are corporativism too in commercial packages communities. If you don't like Blender, leave it alone and stop blaming it. I don't spend my time talking about how good or bad I find 3DSMax interface, because I have more important things to do as a professional, work with blender among them.
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  37. The biggest problem I have with blender is rendering with ray tracing enabled.

    Without ray tracing the scene lacks shadows and textures look 2 dimensional (kind of defeating the purpose of downloading the program).

    But when using ray tracing over a large scene the program either takes hours to render or just crashes.

    I tried following a basic tutorial for a winter scene
    Everything was going okay until the rendering part.

    After over 10 minutes of looking at a black screen it rendered, and I found that the the shadows I made using the sun object looked terrible anyway.

    I don't know whether the slow speed is a graphics card problem on my end or a software problem.
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  38. I disagree with your article. I know it was written in 04, but blender and many other OSS programmes have developed a long way since then. We have been using Blender for 3 years as our core pipeline running on Linux in a production environment, previous to that we were using 3dsmax for 7 years.

    I found the transition from max to Blender to be fairly easy, its exactly the same paradigm, so all you are really learning is a new layout and hotkeys. I think it took maybe 2 months before i was 100% comfortable with blender, but now 3 years on, i can't imagine not using it. The learning curve is steep at first, but plateau's out quite quickly.

    No 3D software is "instant learn", it just requires some work and patience, i suggest using it for 2 weeks and then if you don't feel more comfortable by then, maybe its not for you. However, just because you don't get on with it, doesn't mean its crap.

    For all those peeps complaining about the UI not being identical to Max or Maya, you will be glad to hear that 2.5(which is a total rewrite) will have a customizable UI, where any button/window/menu can be swapped, moved or re-arranged as needed. 2.5 is due out in October i believe. Personally i like the none-blocking /none-overlapping interface. once you get used to it, it makes a big difference to productivity.

    Anyway, i suggest you try it again now it has matured somewhat, you may be surprised at the vastness of the user base and support out there which is all freely available.
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  39. Blender is a useless piece of bloatware, that teaches one nothing except to slap yourself a thousand times.

    --3ds Max User--

    Before you go insulting yourselves I have used nearly every 3d software possible.

    My favorites are: Wings 3d (more deserving than blender), AC3D, Cinema 4D and Lightwave 3D.

    My all time and all around favorite is 3ds Max simply because it allows me to do what I want, it thinks like I do and that's a vital spot for anything 3d. Coming from Maya background and hating it, I adapted very quickly to 3DS. Majority of the basics I picked up were from Wings 3D and AC3D. Which Are by far the best learning tools that can teach you 3D principles I might add.

    Having used Blender as well I felt it had more weak points than strengths, the feature sets it comes bundled with are very shifty at best and act more like dressing. Don't get me wrong they do allow you to do what you want but more times than not your final renders or actual product look like shit defacing any value or emphasis put on Blenders features. Finally being open source, whatever you create in Blender must also be open source as well which is quite stupid.

    Hell even Google Sketchup is a better alternative to Blender!
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  40. am from kenya and started using blender 2 months ago is pretty good once you get the hang of the interface, all the other commercial 3d apps user are just worried because a completely free app that can do all the major 3d tasks has entered their stable, i also have a version of maya but i rarely use it blender put a leash on it
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  41. blender is great

    i agree that they need better tutorials/documentation and stuff. the controls are hard to learn and can be confusing.

    however, it is free and can do just as well as professional 3d modeling programs like 3ds max. they are constantly improving it. they are making the controls less confusing.

    i believe that the fact that it is free will outweigh any deficiencies it has.
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  42. i believe blender is great.

    sometimes though, it can be confusing and it is harder to learn than other 3d softwares.

    in fact, in argentina or somewhere, there is a full length movie made entirely with blender.
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  43. blender is driving me mad i can sense it's powerful, but nothing ever appears the same each time i use it, it's too easy to have a button pressed, that prevents you doing what you want to do and not being able to figure out what button i must deselect, to make it operate how it did five minutes earlier, is just raising my blood pressure.

    the only good thing about it is it has never ever crashed no matter what i do, or even if i click around and experiment without knowing what i'm clicking on, it remains stable.

    Why do all the video tutorials show everything happening so fast, and why do they say go into a certain mode and then in the whatever window click on so and so button. Why don;t they show where and how to click, and why does my screen never look like the video tutorials screen after only a few clicks.

    ARRGHH
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  44. Anyone who claims the interface is a snap to learn is a BOLD-FACED LIAR. I've learned hundreds of programs of varying complexity over the years and I can say without a doubt that next to Gimp, Blender has one of the most esoteric, counter-intuitive, ass backwards GUIs I have ever come across. It makes Pixia and Dog Waffle's bizzaro world GUIs look downright simplistic by comparison. This is not a subject for debate; it is a common complaint, from the noobiest noob to the biggest diehard fanboy. So those of you with your insulting comments aren't impressing "anyone" with your b.s. "I learned it in 2 weeks; you must be stupid" bravado.

    As for the posers calling people "lazy" for not taking the time to learn the GUI, YOU DON'T GET IT. Maybe being an unemployed high school dropout, YOU PERSONALY have all the time in the world to spend several weeks learning how to do basic tasks that in any other program would take under an hour to grasp. But PROS DON'T have the time. They have projects up the butt to complete and deadlines to meet. That's why software geared towards them are designed to be as intuitive and easy to learn as possible, so they can jump right into it without a hassle and finish what they're doing.

    This all isn't an argument in favor or against Blender's "suckiness"; just a response to the smart alecks who've responded in this thread about its interface. The GUI is ass-- finito, end of story.
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  45. I had a big diatribe - but I'll boil it down to this:

    crappy software for free is still crappy software.
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  47. Dude.... you realize that the first thing you learn in Blender is how to edit things in Blender. You were in Object Mode. Try flipping to edit mode (the tab key)
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  48. Blender doesnt suck!
    At first, I thought it did! - I felt the same desperation some of you described, when dealing with so many buttons in an apparent random disposition, the different approach to some basic tools, and also felt much disapointed with the rendered results.
    Even though, I insisted, and came to the conclusion that, once you get the hang of the commands and shortcuts (wich requires some practice), it all makes sense and is very work-oriented (when comparing with other 3d apps), because you only have the essential, and can apply the same tools in different objects and panels, so the interface doesnt get in the way. I find it faster to work with than 3ds or c4d, wich I know very well.
    Now I'm addicted (to version 2.49- I think 2.5 SUCKS!).
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  49. Blender very much DOES suck. Being an avid fan of OSS and reaping the benefits of dozens of very well built OSS programs, Blender continues to flounder around with a TERRIBLE user interface that is impossibly convoluted.

    I agree that Blender is quite capable in terms of image quality. It easily competes with any commercial product. BUT, it's biggest downfall is that it takes MONTHS to become proficient with Blender's interface. And that, alone, is its biggest shortcoming and the very reason that it sucks.

    As a developer, I simply don't have the time to learn a needlessly complicated interface. I've been trying to learn Blender on and off for YEARS now and I still can't do the simplest of things. Adding a texture material to an object feels like pulling teeth having to click through what feels like a dozen different menus.

    Moving objects around is extremely unintutive. Sorry, but when I drag my mouse across the screen I expect the object to go with it. No. Blender does this gesture recognition thing which may be powerful but to a novice user like myself is utterly baffling.

    The User Interface of any program is what makes or breaks a program and Blenders interface crushes it. With 3DS I can get a feel for the interface in about 10 - 20 minutes. With Blender, having used it for 6 some years, the interface continues to be baffling.
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  50. Ergh, Blender has the WORST interface imaginable. Period. Nothing can compare. Any other program you can jump in and do things, it works, I used 3DSMax when I was TEN right off the bat, no tutes, no teacher, nothing. I just DID stuff. I can't do that in Blender, in 2.49 it took me a few minutes to figure out how to OPEN A FILE. How is that possible?

    1. Take the interface.
    2. Throw it ALL out.
    3. Remake it.
    4. Give it to someone.
    5. If they cannot figure out the basic functions inside of 10 minutes you have failed miserably and need to start again or let someone else do it.

    And Gimp has a good GIU, it's basically PS with some things in different catagories. Dragging the menus around is annoying though ... one window dammit :(
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  51. To preface this, I am going to start out by saying that I am not an open source "fanboi" or apologist and will also not use arguments like "you get what you pay for." I use whatever software I am most comfortable with based on the task at hand and advocate that others do the same. I can't stand GIMP or OpenOffice Impress and use Photoshop, ZBrush, Final Cut Studio, Inkscape (FOSS), and Blender (both 2.49 and 2.5) (FOSS) in my workflow and use each of the three main OSes at least once a week on average. I picked up the Blender's interface in about a day and had been playing with other packages (both proprietary and not) for about 2-3 years before I adopted Blender as my primary modeling/animation/CG integration application. While it takes a while (in my case, several months) to fully appreciate the power of the Blender interface, I can attest to the fact that it does make sense and is built around the concept of having a fast, non-linear workflow.

    Addressing specific concerns:

    "Blender is a useless piece of bloatware, that teaches one nothing except to slap yourself a thousand times." - Anonymous 3ds Max User
    The Windows x64 version of the newest Blender Beta is a 27MB zip file that usually takes me under 20 seconds to download. The unzipped version is 76 MB and needs no additional installation, and older versions take 20MB or less. Maya needs 4GB of disk space, and Max needs 3GB. Blender almost never crashes unless you are using an unstable development version.

    "whatever you create in Blender must also be open source as well which is quite stupid" - Anonymous 3ds Max User
    According to the Blender website (http://www.blender.org/education-help/faq/gpl-for-artists/), "Anything you create with Blender - whether it's graphics, movies, scripts, exported 3d files or the .blend files themselves - is your sole property, and can be licensed or sold under any conditions you prefer." The GPL (general public license) comes into play for altered versions of Blender - if you decide to change the code for the program, you may sell these altered versions or distribute them in any way as long as you release the source code under GPL. This ensures that the program itself remains open-source.

    "but nothing ever appears the same each time i use it, it's too easy to have a button pressed, that prevents you doing what you want to do and not being able to figure out what button i must deselect, to make it operate how it did five minutes earlier" - john
    Like most 3d packages, Blender has several modes for applying changes to an object -- you can move vertices in edit mode, move entire objects in edit mode, and do basic sculpting (similar to the core of ZBrush) in sculpt mode. What is unique about Blender when compared to other packages is that it has consistent key combinations across every operating mode. For example, the grab (gkey) will move vertices, edges, faces, objects, bones, compositing nodes, keyframes, and anything else. Most of the standard shortcuts can be used with the left hand on the keyboard and the right hand on the mouse. The settings are configurable so that you can have any window layout you want on as many monitors as you want, and you can use a standard keyboard, laptop keyboard, external mouse, or trackpad.

    "Blender does this gesture recognition thing which may be powerful but to a novice user like myself is utterly baffling." - leeor_net
    I had completely forgotten about that until you mentioned it. Left-click-dragging a round curve is used for rotation, a sharp edge for scaling, and a straight line for moving an object. These gestures are not required and are disabled by default in the Betas of the new release. Pressing G will grab an object for moving, S will scale, and R will rotate.

    Continued in next post…
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  52. ...

    "Anyone who claims the interface is a snap to learn is a BOLD-FACED LIAR. [...] your insulting comments aren't impressing "anyone" with your b.s. "I learned it in 2 weeks; you must be stupid" bravado." - Anonymous
    The interface is certainly atypical when compared to other 3d programs. According to the owner of the Blender Foundation, when a feature could be implemented in a user-friendly way or a way that would be fast and efficient to an experienced user, the latter option was chosen. This is the same difference that exists between word processors that a typical user is used to and something like vim, which requires knowledge of unintuitive key combinations that allow advanced users to make dramatic changes to text extremely quickly. With Blender's 2.5 rewrite that has been in development over the past year or so, however, the interface (and the core code) of the application has been completely rewritten to be both intuitive and fast. Every item in the interface can now be scripted and anything can be animated. It is now possible to customize the user interface in any way one chooses, and there are default keymaps for users of other software (there is already an option for Maya, and I am sure that there will be options for other well-known interfaces once 2.5 becomes fully stable -- it is still in Beta but is usable to the degree that it was used to create Sintel as it was developed).

    ...
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  53. ...

    Some Benefits of Blender:

    - The cost of deployment is extremely low due to its tiny system footprint and the lack of monetary cost. Learning the interface used to be a significant challenge, but is becoming much less of a problem starting with 2.5. While support has been lacking in the past, there are now some very active support forums here:

    http://blenderartists.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=7. As long as you use proper grammar and post information other than "im stuck pls HELP!!!", most issues are resolved relatively quickly. I learned the application using the Blender user manual available on the website and the absolute beginner's guide http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:Tutorials/Animation/BSoD/Character_Animation. While there is limited information about the new Beta versions, there is an active community for this new version, and the development roadmap lists a documentation phase that has only just begun.

    - Since it is open source, you can edit it any way you want. There are film studios that use in-house versions of the software that have been heavily customized to fit their purposes. On http://www.graphicall.org/builds/, you can download bleeding edge releases and builds that are customized for specific purposes such as compositing, sculpting, or modeling. Many features developed in these releases eventually make it into the mainstream program distributed by the Blender Foundation. Universities often use it for research projects ranging from studies of animal behavior to Minority-Report-inspired control interfaces and physical fluid simulation. Try Googling "blender university research."

    - While the interface in Blender is atypical, the software is useful as an introduction to 3d graphics for hobbyists or for people who cannot afford proprietary alternatives. Many people prefer Blender over other solutions and use the application in their workflow alongside proprietary applications (look at http://www.zbrushcentral.com/showthread.php?t=38711, for just one example).

    Legitimacy of Blender:

    In order to improve Blender as a tool for artists rather than developers (as many other OS programs are conceived), the Blender Foundation has created 3 movie projects, Elephant's Dream (http://www.elephantsdream.org/), Big Buck Bunny (http://www.bigbuckbunny.org/; you have probably seen screenshots of this around the web), and Sintel (http://www.sintel.org; this, most recent, movie was selected for Siggraph Asia and the Netherlands Film Festival).

    Weta Workshop (the company that did the FX for Lord of the Rings and Narnia) recently hosted a design competition for Blender.

    The Unity 3D game engine fully supports Blender.


    In short, Blender is much more viable as a professional development solution than it was just a few years ago, and the interface (which seems to be the main complaint) is being revamped to be intuitive and customizable (with and without scripting) by default.

    All software has strong points and weaknesses, and you should use whatever fits your environment and style. I am merely trying to clear up some misconceptions and explain Blender in the context of the past, present, and future.

    Cheers,
    Iulius
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  54. 1. the industrial standart is Maya, not 3Ds Max.
    2. If you're too stupid to accept progressive UI, throw away your comuter.
    3. Just because you don't understand it, doesn't mean it's bad. Check out the beautiful work others have done with blender. I mean, you don't go to a porsche manufacturing plant and declare everything garbage because you don't get the assembly process.
    Once you understood the UI it's actually faster to use than programms bound to conventional UIs.
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  55. You are unbelievably arrogant. Clearly, you see yourself as somehow superior to Blender, its developers, and all Blender users, just because Blender is free and you have no idea how to use it.

    The main reason people don't just 'give up' on expensive software is because they feel a responsibility to make it a worthwhile investment.
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  57. Okay to all the people ragging on those who don't like Blender, please take a moment and stop and think. Blender does have a bad interface, and it is stupid hard for new users. This is especially true for those coming from 3DS Max and Maya (which are both industry standard mind you). I started posting here years ago under Fullflavormenthol, and during that time I have been learing Blender, and honestly I have had the greatest success with books. Maybe instead of being an asshole you could actually give people a recommendation of a good book to learn with or maybe directing them to a good tutorial...and no that isn't Noob to Pro. I am sorry, but that wiki is a little sucky and generates more visists to the BlenderArtist forum than any advert could ever.

    How about Essential Blender, or Mastering Blender, or Compositing with Blender? Each of these books give great explanations for how to accomplish things in the program that professionals want to learn how to do, and they are step by step. This was how I learned Maya and 3DS Max and was how I learned Blender as well.

    I find that when people have trouble with Blender they are not wanting to learn how to make CGI water pour into a bowl...that want to know how to accomplish finished projects.

    http://vimeo.com/785249

    This tutorial taught me how to take a blueprint and turn it into a 3D animation of a house, and I used that animation in a short film that actually got me second place at a film festival. Those are the projects that the professional wants...not a gingerbreadman or lip.

    So before you decide to come across as an ass next time...maybe you might want to think about directing someone to good learning material first.
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  58. Blender is now perfect. It's interface was shit because more important things needed to be done. I have been playing with Blender since 2004 and yeah it's interface 'was' crap, but it still did what I wanted it to do. Also... I can't remember when blender 'didn't' have a manual or 'no' support, that's shit. Now with version 2.59, you get a Max like interface with an interactive media engine for Python.

    Open-source software is actually starting to blossom. All the older open source projects (blender, linux, gnucc, etc) are now surpassing any wallet breaking closed source software (max, windows, msvc, etc). The OP can suck it.
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  59. I worked with Blender for alot of years. And even after all these years, there's still plenty I don't know how to do in Blender. So what I usually do is then switch to Milkshape. Recently, I thought I'd try upgrading from Blender 2.4 to Blender 2.6 I hated the new interface so much I went right back to 2.4 Why they can't put a descent GUI on this program that is simple and uncluttered and uncomplicated is beyond me. I don't care what features a program has if I can't use them. And all the tutorials out are for all different versions which makes it fifty times worse to learn anything. Every time you open a tutorial it's usually for a different version of Blender. So you still can't figure out anything. It's awful.
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